Andrew

2016 Election Season

2,646 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, Mike said:

I'm against this Muslim ban as well. I am all for increased background checks on people coming into America from terrorist countries, but I think he should just keep things the way they are while he works on a plan to do that. It's not like there are terrorists coming here on a daily basis. These people are coming in here legally and they shouldn't be punished for coming in here the right way.

And keep in mind this includes people with dual citizenship, green cards, etc that leave the country on business or vacation. So, let's just say hypothetically that Sami Zayn, who is Canadian but has Syrian parents, hypothetically had Syrian citizenship. He would be blocked from re-entry to the US after going on a tour because of that. It's insane. And not only all those obvious things, you couldn't give ISIS better recruiting material if you tried. 

Also.... 

One really has to wonder where the line exists for Republicans before they turn. 

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3 hours ago, Mike said:

I'm against this Muslim ban as well. I am all for increased background checks on people coming into America from terrorist countries, but I think he should just keep things the way they are while he works on a plan to do that. It's not like there are terrorists coming here on a daily basis. These people are coming in here legally and they shouldn't be punished for coming in here the right way.

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You know what's really stupid about this ban?

16388311_1674514775892827_75957592444021

Yeah that big number there?  9/11.  Trump didn't ban the country that gave us the 9/11 attackers.  He's even bad at being a racist schmuck.

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58 minutes ago, RainbowDragon said:

C3RMkAmWQAAifQe.jpg

Well said but I don't know why you're posting that in response to me. I don't want America to be less safe just for the sake of not offending anybody and I've made my point clear on that. But a ban of innocent people coming here legally doesn't make sense. How can Trump build a wall to keep people from coming here illegally and then at the same time not allow people to come here the way they're supposed to come here legally?

For all the good I think he's doing with the wall, creating jobs, eventual increased background checks on people coming from terrorist countries and taking months instead of years for this stuff to happen, he's also doing some bad as well with this ban, foolish lies/alternative facts and the absurd abortion stuff (which to be fair to Trump who used to be pro choice, I think is more to appease Pence and Trump's foolish bible thumping supporters).

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There's so much craziness going on right now that it's hard to keep up with everything.

Some examples (courtesy of Slate’s Josh Vorhees):

1. Trump replaced the head of the General Services Administration, the federal agency that effectively serves as the landlord for the new Trump hotel in Washington and has been asked to investigate whether Trump is now in violation of that lease.

2. He signed orders clearing the way for the disputed Keystone XL and Dakota Access oil pipelines to proceed. As recently as last summer, the president owned between $15,000 and $50,000 in stock in the company building the Dakota project, and its chief executive donated $100,000 to the Trump Victory Fund, a joint effort between Trump and the Republican Party. (Trump claims to have sold off his stock portfolio before the election, though he has not provided documentation proving he did.)

3. He signed an order suspending visas from seven predominantly Muslim countries. Not on the list were other predominantly Muslim countries where Trump has existing businesses: Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Indonesia, Turkey, Qatar, Dubai, the United Arab Emirates, and Azerbaijan.

4. Trump is pushing forward his plan for a massive, privatization-heavy infrastructure bill that appears tailor-made for cronyism and self-dealing. (For more on this, please see our video.)

5. Based on the new power of the “Trump” brand, the CEO of Trump Hotels announced a plan to triple the number of Trump hotels in the United States.

6. The Trump Organization hired a longtime Republican lawyer as its ethics adviser and a longtime Trump executive as its chief compliance counsel. It’s all optics. Neither will raise a fuss because they’d put their jobs at risk.

7. The Trump-owned Mar-a-Lago resort in Palm Beach, Florida, doubled its initiation fee to $200,000 for new members.

8. The American Chamber of Commerce in Canada, a business lobby focused on North American trade, made a sudden, last-second decision to move a scheduled event from the Vancouver home of a U.S. diplomat to the newest addition to the Trump Hotel family in the same city. (The Trump Organization does not own the Trump International Hotel & Tower Vancouver, but it makes money managing the property and cutting naming-rights deals.)

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Side note: Should we make a new thread (or update this thread's name) for US Politics since this technically isn't 2016 Election stuff anymore?

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3 minutes ago, Koldes said:

Side note: Should we make a new thread (or update this thread's name) for US Politics since this technically isn't 2016 Election stuff anymore?

I was wondering the same thing. Maybe we should lock this thread and retire it and move the discussion over to the world news thread which seems perfect for discussion like the stuff we're having. The election is long over now, this is world news talk.

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21 minutes ago, Mike said:

I was wondering the same thing. Maybe we should lock this thread and retire it and move the discussion over to the world news thread which seems perfect for discussion like the stuff we're having. The election is long over now, this is world news talk.

My vote would be to lock it, but I think that we should make a whole new thread for US Politics. Although America's policies and politics do impact the world most of the time (especially with immigration/visas) there's a lot of domestic stuff that is not world news. And there's a lot of World News that doesn't necessarily impact America. 

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Maybe just get the word "world" out of the news thread? It's not like there's a ton of non-US news talk anyways. That way that thread could be for any news. I don't know. This is all above my pay grade. Pen or Andrew can decide.

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8 minutes ago, RainbowDragon said:

I need to inform Mike from Massachusetts that Slate is a far left website. Pay attention, Mike.

I don't know why you're saying it to just Mike considering I posted it for everyone and not just him...

But, show me what is wrong from what I posted. Don't just say "it's far left" and discredit the source, discrediting my entire post, tell me specifics on what pieces of those things that Trump did is wrong. Then you will have credibility with why the source is bad and maybe people will listen to you, like with your suggestion to lock the thread. If you can't show me specifically what's wrong, you are basically doing the same thing Trump does by saying "FAKE NEWS!" when someone says something you don't like, from a source you don't like, rather than showing how they are wrong.

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7 minutes ago, RainbowDragon said:

Its just a 30 day ban and its not permanent, right ?

It's a minimum of a 90 day ban which can be transitioned into different legislation that could be permanent, more broad, etc.

The length of it is completely irrelevant to the points that the Slate person made that I posted above. What they were referencing was the corruption/hypocrisy of banning people from countries that haven't committed terrorism in the US and leaving those open who have (see Andrew's chart.) And those same countries have investments by Trump's businesses...

You chose 1 of the 8 things to counter since it's a 'far left source' and didn't really even counter the main objection: the hypocrisy, corruption, and banning people from the "wrong countries" (if you're going to do such a thing.)

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Dude, there's left wing leaning sites and right wing leaning sites. I dont know any site thats completely neutral and independent. Quoting Slate is like quoting Brietbart.

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Just now, RainbowDragon said:

Dude, there's left wing leaning sites and right wing leaning sites. I dont know any site thats completely neutral and independent. Quoting Slate is like quoting Brietbart.

Again, for the third time, you're trash talking a source, without picking apart the substance of what the person said. If they're such a far leaning left wing site that they cannot be trusted, why are you having such a hard time picking apart what was stated?

Additionally, if you don't know of any sites that are neutral and independent (I know of some that do a pretty good job) than how can anything be bad or good if there's no such thing as a good sources? 

P.S. This is exactly what Trump and his team have been wanting: No one is truth, everyone is fake news, everyone is extremely biased, therefore we should only listen to him and his team.

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11 minutes ago, RainbowDragon said:

Dude, there's left wing leaning sites and right wing leaning sites. I dont know any site thats completely neutral and independent. Quoting Slate is like quoting Brietbart.

So what you're saying is that you have nothing to say.

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The thing that really gets me is that anyone beyond his brainwashed zombies actually still believes that he's a principled guy who's got the American people's best interests in mind. His nature has been abundantly clear to me and many others from day one, but we're at a point now where I genuinely can't comprehend how somebody looks at him as just another president trying to do a good job with a bunch of people who think he's good and others who hate him. It's so far beyond that. 

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1 hour ago, Ruiner said:

The thing that really gets me is that anyone beyond his brainwashed zombies actually still believes that he's a principled guy who's got the American people's best interests in mind. His nature has been abundantly clear to me and many others from day one, but we're at a point now where I genuinely can't comprehend how somebody looks at him as just another president trying to do a good job with a bunch of people who think he's good and others who hate him. It's so far beyond that. 

Beyond his most rabid people, I'm not sure how many people actually believe that. It's just anecdotal experience, but I've talked to quite a few people who either didn't vote for POTUS, or reluctantly voted for Trump because they hated Hillary so much, and a lot of them realize he's a piece of garbage, but are hoping our Constitution and other regulations, decent people in the government and the media can help keep him in check, and want a conservative Justice appointed.

Also, Robert Reich (if you trust him to speak truth as a credible source, I do) recounts a conversation that just he had with a former GOP member of Congress

https://www.facebook.com/RBReich/posts/1445206565491935

"I had breakfast recently with a friend who's a former Republican member of Congress. Here's what he said:

Him: Trump is no Republican. He’s just a big fat ego.

Me: Then why didn’t you speak out against him during the campaign?

Him: You kidding? I was surrounded by Trump voters. I’d have been shot.

Me: So what now? What are your former Republican colleagues going to do?

Him (smirking): They’ll play along for a while.

Me: A while?

Him: They’ll get as much as they want – tax cuts galore, deregulation, military buildup, slash all those poverty programs, and then get to work on Social Security and Medicare – and blame him. And he’s such a fool he’ll want to take credit for everything.

Me: And then what?

Him (laughing): They like Pence.

Me: What do you mean?

Him: Pence is their guy. They all think Trump is out of his mind.

Me: So what?

Him: So the moment Trump does something really dumb – steps over the line – violates the law in a big stupid clumsy way … and you know he will ...

Me: They impeach him?

Him: You bet. They pull the trigger."

My hope is that a lot of people aren't speaking out, but realize how damaging he really is. When the chips fall, we'll certainly hold them accountable for not speaking out, though... 

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Haha, nevermind, I completely missed the new thread due to Andrew's awesome title. Moving my convo over there.

 

 

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